I like what's being done with South City. Will this mean more S. City Layouts? Or are the original tracks being changed? And what about the train? If you're gonna have street lights and a mall... Oh and do something with the reference people. Gheesh. I remember making a skin and was gonna show in a screenshot at fern bay with what I thought were girls in bikinis..... Yeah. That didn't go over too good. Yeah. Put gender identity on them. It really is impressive though.

Sweden, Sweden, SWEDEN!!!! Oh... the reason I'm posting this is because of a TV series I'm watching on Netflix. This is a really good show - that is if you like cop shows. Granted, it's not as intense as The Shield or The Wire(the best show HBO ever came up with - it's better than GOT), but it's in the same neighborhood. But anyways the Show is called Young Wallander. If you get a chance to watch it, give it shot.

Hmmmm.... One thing about using others' set-ups. Most are geared for getting a WR and is really only good for a couple of laps. Also, these set-ups are usually geared to the driving style of the person that made it. So finding the right one you want may take trying a few different set-ups. Another thing you could do is once you download a set-up you like, notice where all the sliders are on that one compared to the stock set-up. It can help once you decide to make your own.

Quote from 5tag :

I still don't get the connection you wanted to draw here. LFS is a racing simulation. It simulates realistic tracks and cars. The wheel base, drivetrain layout etc. are inspired by real life counterparts, and some are even licensed copies. So the devs don't have to "re-invent the wheel", they look at the real thing and figure out how to build that in a program - just different enough as not to violate intellectual property law.

Now about the Hotwheels... those already exist, right? You don't have to make them, not at all. You can't even change wheel base etc.

What I'd like to see is a Hotwheels track in LFS, where you can complete a lap or point-to-point race without any steering input.



This particular bit is a matter of perspective. If you're designing a stretch of public road, you want to make that as safe, pleasant and smooth as possible. However for a race track, you could come up with all kinds of weird shapes and inclines, and leave it to the drivers to figure out the fastest, most efficient ways to navigate them. Of course modern tracks avoid ridiculous sections (look at Hockenheim or Spa through the decades), and a fictional yet realistic sim tries to reflect the historic context. But essentially you could sell every track design flaw as part of the challenge.

Actually we were thinking of stealing cars from lfs and printing the bodies.... We looked into printing the track pieces, but the time it takes to print one little section, I can make a whole 180 degree banked turn out of a couple a pieces of cardboard in a fraction of the time. But we're gonna scrap the cardboard and use coroplast instead - corrugated plastic like what they make cheap yard signs out of.

"But essentially you could sell every track design flaw as part of the challenge."
That's where there's a difference. You have a flaw in our track and you'll have cars flying off the track or losing momentum.

Quote from 5tag :

That sounds like a setup issue, what do you mean?

yeah. It kinda does, but no I meant things like determining wheel base. and there's all those moving parts you have to take into account. Not to mention other stuff like determining downforce. In my case the track is way harder than making a car for it. oh and to be clear, this is a "fat track" we're making. one where there isn't a divider going down the middle of the track. so it's double the headache. The "cars" themselves are simple. I just know, that if I were to try and make a "working" car to run on this track it would be a nightmare. At least for me.

OK.... One of the reasons I came up with this question to begin with is because of a project I'm working on with my oldest grandkid. She's hooked on youtube videos with hot wheel car racing. Actually, they really are pretty cool. So we're trying to build a track from scratch. I went overboard with it of course and now have little formulas I use to determine where to cut the card board to get the correct angle and diameter for the cars to turn on.. Figuring all this out is a pain in the @ss and a lot of trial and error. Transitioning from a flat straight to a banked section is the pain of the moment. But it gives me some sort of clue as to what goes on when making say Westhill. But seeing that all I have for a car is a simple hotwheel, I try to gear the track to the limitations of the car. But I began to wonder what it must be like to figure out how to make a car work best on a track(s). It can't just be putting four wheels on a chassis with a pretty body in comparison. I dunno. Maybe the more complex the vehicle, the more complex the track...

So the consensus is tracks are the hard part. I know one thing, I'd hate to have to make either one though. Even if it is just laser scanning a real race track. one thing I didn't take into account Not just designing the track, but designing how the track handles the effects of the cars. That's gotta suck figuring out the graphic for which car for skidmarks happening at once in corners.

Quote from lfsrm :

I mean it's better if you have ten artists building assets at the same time than one, unless you are not constrained by deadlines, it doesn't have the same complex management as other area like core programming, which is a nightmare to coordinate.

I do agree about cars physics, it's generally a one person work if we only take into account the simracing genra, but it's totally possible to find persons who understand your work and know how to apply numbers ( well some actual physics devs started as modders ), I mean if you want to make a 200 cars racing sim you definitively don't want to work alone applying and testing data for all those cars.

"I mean it's better if you have ten artists building assets at the same time than one, unless you are not constrained by deadlines,..."
Deadlines. That's the key there. Well that and who the ten artists involved are We're currently dealing with a project manager that seems to think they are exempt from deadlines.....
But I pretty much meant as in this particular game. One person. One track/car And every little everything involved in making of both..... Still leaning towards track though. Like with the track... you make turn one coming off a fairly long straight. You're gonna want to make that turn a decent radius. too tight and they waste half of the straight braking. too wide? well there are area limitations. That's along with knowing the limitations of rise on inclines and stuff like that. Then the car. All that goes into code in all the braking, roll over/understeer, downforce and so forth to be able to take that turn. Not to mention what goes into making all that look pretty, with determining the trees and wheels for either.

Quote from lfsrm :

Without taking into account the layout design, the amount of assets you have to model just to get close to modern standard make it a never ending project.

Environment design/building is definitively one of those area where you'd better work with a big team.

"Environment design/building is definitively one of those area where you'd better work with a big team." Uh I'm involved in these things all the time at a certain level. I'm currently involved with a "big team"project. And it's a total cluster. And you could say the same thing about coding the car - this guy figuring out the torque and that one the window tint. I dunno. I'm inclined to think track too. But the intricacies of the car?I have no real clue whatsoever as to how they make either one.

Quote from Flotch :

indeed tracks looks like to take time to be well done
Maybe Racer Y was including the physics part into the time taken into account when asking about the global time to spend on each (but as far as I understand how LFS seems to behave, the physics are not typical for each car, but something a bit more global ... but again, its only imo)

Hope Fern Bay is going well dear Eric

Yeah. I'm including everything from tire wear to tree lines. I mean in the most basic terms, it would be the track. All it would have to be was a simple circle. The car would be harder cause you'd have to make something to go around that circle. What i'm thinking of is more along the lines of comparing making South City to the formula v8. And Fern Bay? I hope they don't get rid of the quarter pipe.

I dunno. The thought didn't occur to me until recently. But just what is harder to make in this game? A track? or a car?

Quote from MadDenker :

Thanks for the reply Racer Y.

I hear what you're saying, but LFS does provide me a lot of value as a simulator, way more than other titles out there, hence why I drive LFS. I would also argue that there is a lot of value to running laps in the simulator to improve real world performance. For instance, I am driving Mid-Ohio in mid September. I've never driven there. I only get about 3 hours on track in a weekend. So, if it takes 1-2 hours to learn the track and the braking points, that leaves me very little time to really charge the circuit and find the limits, usually at the very end of the second day. Even a few hours on the simulator would help immensely. True I could get some of that from a game, but the better the simulator, the more valuable the virtual training is.

Good point. LFS as far as the physics goes in it's game engine, can give you half a clue as to what to expect and what to look for in a circuit - if they modeled that particular track. I still think wheels on the ground is still the best way to accomplish this versus LFS, but if you only have 1-2 hours to get to know a track and racing against people that know the track like the back of their hand, something that accurately represents the track would be a big help in that regard. I think I misunderstood your original post.

Quote from MadDenker :

I would like to see many more tracks added. The main reason I drive LFS (a simulator rather than a game) is to get experience on a track before I race there in real life.

Is there any possibility that we can get many more real-world tracks in the game? I can help out as much as possible. The closest and most interesting one for me is Pocono Raceway, which has multiple configurations. I realize it is similar to Kyoto, but again, for me the point is to use the LFS simulator for real-world training. :-)

Yeah... everyone wants new tracks. I wanna track with a loop in it. Uhhh... no matter how you try to spin it, LFS is a video game. And you're never going to get that experience you want from just going around in a circle in a video game as what you will in real life. No matter how good the physics are or how well the track is modeled, it just ain't gonna happen. It might even work against you. Sure there are things about this game that can help you overall at a basic level, like getting an ideal for proper braking and learning to look for the best race line. You really don't need a specific car/track combo for that though. But this game leaves a lot out. Like how to deal with the effects of G-forces, negotiating random elements that appear on the track. How far you can push your car without screwing it up. You have to figure that out by actually driving a real vehicle on a real track. The cars in the game are optimized to be the best they can be, not the best as dictated by the limitations of your pit crew or financial limits.

I haven't seen this crack video on youtube. I'm not really interested in doing so either. But I'm wondering something, does this video generate ads like what other YT videos do? If so you can attack them there. Go after the advertisers and threaten to organize boycotts of their products and services. Before YT "cracked" down on racist/fake news/conspiracy videos, that's what people did to get those videos yanked. With the economy the way it is these days, the threat of a boycott carries some weight. As far as going after the crackers (LOL crackers) directly? Forget about the legal route. That's a waste of time. DDS attacks, and massive spam campaigns claiming the cracked versions are full of ransomware would be more effective. Maybe put up a sting site that offers a cracked version that really IS full of malware. What could they do about it?

Quote from Sponge :

I hope you’re joking :’)

Anyway, LFS is still very affordable for how good it is... I’ve paid much more for games from big developers that weren’t 1% as good.

Wow. You had to ask if I was joking?
Let's see... When I got S1 it cost about 24.00 USD. S2 was around $20 and S3 was I think $18.00. I'm good with it. I just happened to be reading this thread when a goofy commercial for a personal injury lawyer came on TV.
I actually think the sliding scale is a good idea. But I do wonder if anyone immigrated to another country to get a better price.

Quote from cargame.nl :

But less USD. It's magic wóohoo it's magic.

I dunno. I think I been discriminated against. I should sue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q67cD8pDgqk

RIP Little Richard.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQ6akiGRcL8

9 pounds? NINE POUNDS?!?!?!? I had pay 12 pounds a pop for mine.

I read somewhere that with the virus shutdowns, a lot of folks aren't bathing as much. If that's true, I imagine there are all sorts of dirty drivers out there. I wouldn't know. I is a essential employee. You tell me what's essential about making a sign where blind people can find the bathroom in a skyscraper that's shut down and we'll both know. At least I'm not a dirty driver

You know, a few weeks back I started a thread - or tried to start a thread discussing similar topics regarding mods. My main concern was having some sort of standards put into place to avoid compatibility issues.... And of course it was treated like I was committing Heresy so I said, "F***i it" and let it die. But I still think that y'all developers need to get ahead of the curve on modding before it gets started. Looks like that's the case. I never thought about the legal hassles of people importing other cars from other games into LFS though. Or getting static from car manufacturers. I guess I should've remembering Unreal Tournament (quake?) and Continental Airlines. Oh well the important thing is y'all are trying to plan ahead on this and not just dicking around with tires.

I dunno.... What about a ghost track? Wouldn't that be fun?

Ghost Car?

Quote from gu3st :

You've put the cart 10 miles before the horse.

No. I'm trying to plan ahead. More like get others (cough Scawen cough) to take it into consideration. It would really suck to have all that and then be almost impossible for everyone to get on the same page. All I have to go off of is NASCAR 2003 as far as mods goes and to be honest, those were a bit of a cluster to get sorted out just for single player. Multi player? Yeah good luck with that unless you wanted to just play with the same five people or so.
I think it's something that should be thought out a good ways ahead of S3 final.
Not just, "Here's a car" "Here's a track" and then hope for the best.

Yeah. I know mods are kind of a taboo subject, but This post isn't so much about this car or that track. What I want to know is how the original game interface will work with that. And how would those mods work with the existing game in multi-player. Like if someone was to make some track and have races for it on the server would you have to go online and look for the track? Or would you be able to download it right there on the main server as your waiting to join? And as far as cars goes. Would that be about the same thing? I guess what I'm asking is how well would access to these mods be in the original game? Are there going to be some sort of parameters?

Wow.... How big is your monitor dude?